case dismissed...

[chrisw]

sometimes a lawyer is worth it, even when you know you can win on your own.

back in June while coming back from an autocross at candlestick park, I got pulled over by a fucking tool of a park ranger on Rt 9, just south of skyline blvd. I had seen this idiot, saw him bumper pace me, and just before I left castle rock state park, he popped the lights.

he got me for not having the front license plate and speeding (a totally bullshit charge ). So rather than fight the idiot on my own (this was just a month after crashing my audi), I hired a lawyer.

I was charged with the most basic speed law available to him (vc 22350) http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc22350.htm. basically, all the ranger had to do was demonstrate that I was driving fast, over the speed limit. technically I guess I was, while the idiot was bumper pacing me, I kept the car in 4th gear at ~3000rpm or aproximately 45-50mph. The ticket said I was going 55.

so the court date came up, I talked with the lawyer before the court apearance and left satisfied that I could get the case dismissed. We had talked about if I had been speeding, how I had modified the evo for better handling, how twisty the road was, and how we get profiled by the police. I didn't even bother showing up...

I got the call back from the lawyer, "case dismissed, I love winning!"

aparently the park ranger had written up his own lengthy deposition, but when it came down to the topic of speed, my lawyer objected to some of his testimony and under cross examination, asked if the ranger had his speedometer calibrated recently and if so, where was the recipt? According to my lawyer, the ranger just stood there looking stupid when asked that question. So the judge said, if you can't provide the proof of radar certification (I guess that includes bumper pacing instruction and qualifications) then case dismissed.

In all actuallity, the lawyer was more expensive than the fine, but getting the case dismissed, not having another point on the license; priceless..

8)

I would suggest that everyone get a lawyer if you feel that you have been profiled in your most recent incidents. If we all do this, maybe the courts will look more favorably towards the profiling of cars that we love to drive.



[update]

My roommate works for the state park system. She tells me that park rangers are now full peace officers, so they have the same jurisdicion as a police officer within a state park boundary. oh joy, they get to play both rolls, ranger rick and officer bob for the same low pay (lower than your typical police officer)

[DirectorSe7en]

Wow. Very nice job, well played.

I have a court date coming up, maybe I'll consider a Lawyer just to be sure.

[ZK]

How much is the lawyer to hire?

I think most people don't know who to call and/or the lawyer is too expensive for them so they end up taking the hit.

[chrisw]

How much is the lawyer to hire?

I think most people don't know who to call and/or the lawyer is too expensive for them so they end up taking the hit.


good point...

The lawyer cost me $500 flat fee for the consultation and court apearance.

[awdaddict]

$500?
That's like almost 2 times of a normal moving violation.

Most people would rather fight on their own (if they know about trial by written declaration)
Or take the hit.

Personally, I wouldn't lawyer up unless I know I will not be qualified for traffic school.
Or if it is some multiple points, something serious and expensive fines. :P

gratz that u won though.
Now I learn something new about the speedo calibration for pacing!

[Ben]

$500?
That's like almost 2 times of a normal moving violation.

Most people would rather fight on their own (if they know about trial by written declaration)
Or take the hit.

Personally, I wouldn't lawyer up unless I know I will not be qualified for traffic school.
Or if it is some multiple points, something serious and expensive fines. :P

gratz that u won though.
Now I learn something new about the speedo calibration for pacing!


$500 might be a lot but it's like he learned something new that he can pass along as well as saving himself from having a point on his record which could raise his insurance enough to make this $500 look pretty small.

[chrisw]

$500?
That's like almost 2 times of a normal moving violation.

Most people would rather fight on their own (if they know about trial by written declaration)
Or take the hit.

Personally, I wouldn't lawyer up unless I know I will not be qualified for traffic school.
Or if it is some multiple points, something serious and expensive fines. :P

gratz that u won though.
Now I learn something new about the speedo calibration for pacing!


$500 might be a lot but it's like he learned something new that he can pass along as well as saving himself from having a point on his record which could raise his insurance enough to make this $500 look pretty small.


yep, I also was not elligible for traffic school, since you are only allowed to enroll once every 18 months.

[--anonimuz]

shit I'd rather pay $500 actually.. if I know I'm gonnw win with a lawyer..

[Positron]

LOL goodshit!

[joshesh]

500 is not bad at all. My last 2 speeding tickets cost me about 400+ each!

[PANGES]

$500?
That's like almost 2 times of a normal moving violation.

Most people would rather fight on their own (if they know about trial by written declaration)
Or take the hit.

Personally, I wouldn't lawyer up unless I know I will not be qualified for traffic school.
Or if it is some multiple points, something serious and expensive fines. :P

gratz that u won though.
Now I learn something new about the speedo calibration for pacing!


Most insurance companies will give you a break on your first violation/accidnet and just raise you premium a tiny bit. Kinda a slap on the wrist. But your 2nd violation/accident, they take away your good driver discount and double or tripple your premium. lol. So Depending on how much u pay and if you've already had one mark, It might be cheaper to pay the $500 for the lawyer.

Good job, Chris. Even if it does cost me a little more than just paying the ticket, I'd rather hire the lawyer just to make the cop/ranger feel like a dumbass.

[dsmdeliverybo]

Something similar happened with me, I got a speeding ticket when I worked out on the air force base here and I have a friend who's studying to be a highway patrol and he told me when I go to court to bring up the whole calibration thing because most people dont know about that and I did and won the case. Saved me from paying a $512 ticket

[Segfault]

Congrats Chris! I'll have to look into a lawyer next time if I fail trial by written declaration.

[nightwalker]

Way to stick it to 'em. Anyone know of any good traffic lawyers?

[awdaddict]

So, rule of thumb:

If the cop paced you, ask for speedometer calibration + receipt if it's been done.
If the cop radar gun you, ask for radar gun calibration + receipt..
same for LIDAR? :P

[Ben]

If the cop radar gun you, ask for radar gun calibration + receipt..


Really? Shiet I'm gonna be speeding everywhere now!

[wilson1]

Glad it's over and the case dismissed!

[turbotiger]

If they catch you on radar, they need a certificate for calibration. If they paced you, they need a certificate for their speedometer. If they use radar on a local highway, they also need a speed survey, and you need to be going faster than the speed survey. Speed limits can be set lower than the speed survey, but they can't ticket you for going over the speed survey.

[Underated4g64]

where can you get info on the speed survey? i have heard of this but i havent been able to find the info anywhere

[DetailAddict]

wow $500 is steep but the fact you just leave everything to the lawyer that really saves a lot of time and headache. especially when traffic school is not an option, i believe it's worth it. :) congrats!

[ZK]

If they catch you on Lidar, you're screwed. It takes a picture of you with the speed indicated. Plus it is line of sight and accurate compared to radar. No advance warning either if you have a detector.

[ZK]

where can you get info on the speed survey? i have heard of this but i havent been able to find the info anywhere


Speed surveys you can only use if you got a ticket on a local street. You go to the city's transportation department and request it. At highway speeds, speed surveys can't be used.

[DetailAddict]

wow! they take a PICTURE of you? damn, that's crazy!



If they catch you on Lidar, you're screwed. It takes a picture of you with the speed indicated. Plus it is line of sight and accurate compared to radar. No advance warning either if you have a detector.

[ZK]

wow! they take a PICTURE of you? damn, that's crazy!



If they catch you on Lidar, you're screwed. It takes a picture of you with the speed indicated. Plus it is line of sight and accurate compared to radar. No advance warning either if you have a detector.



They get this on their gun display.
http://www.laserveil.com/images.new/target2-sm-comp.jpg

Photo lidar is used for automated speed cameras.

[DetailAddict]

ahh... i see... thanks for the pic! :)





wow! they take a PICTURE of you? damn, that's crazy!



If they catch you on Lidar, you're screwed. It takes a picture of you with the speed indicated. Plus it is line of sight and accurate compared to radar. No advance warning either if you have a detector.



They get this on their gun display.
http://www.laserveil.com/images.new/target2-sm-comp.jpg

Photo lidar is used for automated speed cameras.

[Underated4g64]

where can you get info on the speed survey? i have heard of this but i havent been able to find the info anywhere


Speed surveys you can only use if you got a ticket on a local street. You go to the city's transportation department and request it. At highway speeds, speed surveys can't be used.


thanks for the info on that

[turbotiger]

Older Lidar guns don't take pictures.
I'm not sure what the consensus was on lidar needing a calibration certificate either.

[JDMevoBOOST]

yah speeding tickets are easy to fight. It's the red light running where u fall victim to the cops perspective.

The one ticket I had was from "running a red" on stanyan/haight in a mazda mpv. The yellow light was less than two seconds long. In the DMV handbook it says yellow light is supposed to last 4-5 seconds, which it did not. I argued that myself in court and still got handed the ticket because the judge said that a cop is trained to watch the front of your car cross that second line of the crosswalk and that his perspective was better than mine. Total BS. The cop was 50 and was wearing corrective lenses. If his vision was so damn good, then why the hell is he wearing glasses. I should have asked when was the last time you had your eyes checked at the optometrist and when was the last time he got new glasses/lenses.....damnit....always think of the good arguments when its too late. oh well.

[awdaddict]

wow! they take a PICTURE of you? damn, that's crazy!



If they catch you on Lidar, you're screwed. It takes a picture of you with the speed indicated. Plus it is line of sight and accurate compared to radar. No advance warning either if you have a detector.



They get this on their gun display.
http://www.laserveil.com/images.new/target2-sm-comp.jpg

Photo lidar is used for automated speed cameras.

Don't you ask for the "arresting officer" if you get caught on something automatic device?

[ZK]

wow! they take a PICTURE of you? damn, that's crazy!



If they catch you on Lidar, you're screwed. It takes a picture of you with the speed indicated. Plus it is line of sight and accurate compared to radar. No advance warning either if you have a detector.



They get this on their gun display.
http://www.laserveil.com/images.new/target2-sm-comp.jpg

Photo lidar is used for automated speed cameras.

Don't you ask for the "arresting officer" if you get caught on something automatic device?


Yeah, you can go to court and the automatic photo camera won't show up to court. :lol: