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View Full Version : 400 md whp on piss...



guntings
01-29-2006, 11:31 AM
Guys,

Ya think we can get 400 whp using only piss 91 octane on a reliable mustang dyno by bolting on the IX turbo on our VIII motors and having supporting mods (like cams, tb, flash, etc.) or is the trubo not capable of that???

Lemme know what u think. :wink:

EvoVIII
01-29-2006, 11:39 AM
impossiable, but maybe a stroker and a injection kit would help u there

guntings
01-29-2006, 11:49 AM
impossiable, but maybe a stroker and a injection kit would help u there


Ahh, fu*king w/ the internals....One of the final frontiers in the evolution of the Evolution...

Dunnno bout that yet, but I'm seriously thinking bout pulling the trigger on this trubo....With this trubo and headers and o2 housing... along with a full tb, cams, intake, aftermarket cooler and piping, and reflashing everything, I'm looking to get somewhere above 300 awhp on a mustang dyno...hopefully...

earlyapex
01-29-2006, 11:54 AM
Impossible on 91 octane, even with alky injection. Hell, I don't think even 100 octane would get close on a stock based turbo.

Even a GT35R would have a hard time getting close to 400awhp on 91.

guntings
01-29-2006, 11:58 AM
Even a GT35R would have a hard time getting close to 400awhp on 91.

1stockevo got 386 awhp on his gt30 setup at full fuction's dyno on 91...

and that wasn't even dialing it in all the way..

EvoVIII
01-29-2006, 12:10 PM
impossiable, but maybe a stroker and a injection kit would help u there


Ahh, fu*king w/ the internals....One of the final frontiers in the evolution of the Evolution...

Dunnno bout that yet, but I'm seriously thinking bout pulling the trigger on this trubo....With this trubo and headers and o2 housing... along with a full tb, cams, intake, aftermarket cooler and piping, and reflashing everything, I'm looking to get somewhere above 300 awhp on a mustang dyno...hopefully...
yeah you can go over 300whp on a mustang, but not 400whp..

guntings
01-29-2006, 12:15 PM
yeah you can go over 300whp on a mustang, but not 400whp..

Well, how much over 300 is the real question???

earlyapex
01-29-2006, 12:40 PM
Well, how much over 300 is the real question???

hard to tell because we aren't sure yet how a evo 9 turbo will respond on a non-mivec evo 8.

For arguements sake, let's say they make about 15whp peak more over a Evo 8 turbo with 10.5 hotside.

If I stuck that turbo on my car, as is. I would make 316whp.

Who knows how it would respond on 100 octane.

In reality, I think it won't make much more peak, but like the White Rabbit, you would most likely see gains in other areas of the curve.

Now, coming from a 9.8 hotside 03 or 04, you would see much more gains, probably more than double that.

earlyapex
01-29-2006, 12:43 PM
Even a GT35R would have a hard time getting close to 400awhp on 91.

1stockevo got 386 awhp on his gt30 setup at full fuction's dyno on 91...

and that wasn't even dialing it in all the way..

Where are the charts? What GT30R setup? I have a hard time believing that.

guntings
01-29-2006, 12:56 PM
Ask him urself....hey Abe, where u at???

earlyapex
01-29-2006, 04:08 PM
Ask him urself....hey Abe, where u at???

Yea would be nice to see some charts, what boost, etc

I know Asitha's vishnu stage 2 with a GT3037R I believe on 91 octane (22psi) make about 320whp or so on the vishnu dyno on 91 octane, and about 400whp (28psi) on race gas.

If he is making 380whp on 91 octane and sane boost levels I want to see it because that's amazing.

380whp on 91 sounds like a dynojet number.

here is another one on 107 octane: (DD dynos are pretty darn close to the gruppe-s MD dyno)

http://dyno4mance.com/wc_images/Mitsubishi_Evo_Stage3_1.jpg_big.jpg

Steiner
01-29-2006, 09:22 PM
I also like the sound of the 20G IX but I refuse to seriously consider this turbo until Buschur can show an example of what it can do for a BPU+ (TBE, cams, software) Evo VIII on pump. I'll even be happy with some 94 octane numbers. Right now all he's done is advertise the HP/TQ gains his fully tweaked shop car has made on race gas. That's nice and all but it's so over the top from what most people want or can afford for their Evo...especially if it's a daily driver.

I'm also still somewhat unsure on the reliability of Buschur's 20G's for the Evo. Seems like lots of so called turbo experts are split on how durable this turbo is. I've heard some say that the TD05 20G's Buschur sells are basically just a reverse scroll design of a model that gues back to the Fuso diesel turbos of the 70's. Others have said that putting a 20G wheel on the 16G shaft is a recipe for disaster. Other say the 20G (whether for DSM or Evo) is a great turbo with incredible durability. I'm just not sure yet. I'm gonna give it a few more months and see what the first batch of 20G IX buyers have to say.

1StockEvo
01-30-2006, 12:53 AM
Even a GT35R would have a hard time getting close to 400awhp on 91.

1stockevo got 386 awhp on his gt30 setup at full fuction's dyno on 91...

and that wasn't even dialing it in all the way..

To clarify things I made 372 awhp on Full Functions Mustang dyno on 91 piss gas. This was still only our base tune with a very conservative AFR and the cams were not dialed in yet. Also this was on about 23-24psi. O ya spool up is very close to stock. I will get the dyno charts up soon.

1StockEvo
01-30-2006, 12:57 AM
Even a GT35R would have a hard time getting close to 400awhp on 91.

1stockevo got 386 awhp on his gt30 setup at full fuction's dyno on 91...

and that wasn't even dialing it in all the way..

Where are the charts? What GT30R setup? I have a hard time believing that.

The GT30r kit is the prototype Full Function turbo kit that will be available very soon. But I will let Full Function chime in on the kit and what it is going to entail. I will try to get the charts up soon. Hopefully within the next day or two. Also this was done on 91 octane 76 brand petrol from the 76 station by Union Landing.

Steiner
01-30-2006, 01:02 AM
Even a GT35R would have a hard time getting close to 400awhp on 91.

1stockevo got 386 awhp on his gt30 setup at full fuction's dyno on 91...

and that wasn't even dialing it in all the way..

To clarify things I made 372 awhp on Full Functions Mustang dyno on 91 piss gas. This was still only our base tune with a very conservative AFR and the cams were not dialed in yet. Also this was on about 23-24psi. O ya spool up is very close to stock. I will get the dyno charts up soon.
Which GT30 was it? Also what do you consider "very close" to stock spool?

1StockEvo
01-30-2006, 01:10 AM
Garrett GT30R with a .63 A/R. The turbo starts spoolin around 2800-3000 and I hit full boost at about 3800-4000 I believe. It surprised me how the spool up was also. I didn't expect the car to spool so fast. My power band is one of the greatest I've seen I make power all the way up to my 8000 rpm limit. But I will post the graphs soon.

1StockEvo
01-30-2006, 01:18 AM
Before anyone asks what cams I using. I am running full Revolver cams, valve springs and retainers. I am very pleased with the results from these cams and the quality is by far the greatest I've seen. Also Buschar just tested these cams and posted the results from what he squeezed out of them on Evolutionm. All I have to say was that he was also really pleased.

earlyapex
01-30-2006, 10:32 AM
stock spool and 380whp on 91 pump?

I gotta see this to believe it. If it's true, congrats, those are going to sell like hotcakes since no other kit comes close to that.

btw, full boost at 4k is not "close to stock". Don't confuse trq peak to full boost. It is however better than any other GT30 kit I have seen.

Steiner
01-30-2006, 08:59 PM
Garrett GT30R with a .63 A/R. The turbo starts spoolin around 2800-3000 and I hit full boost at about 3800-4000 I believe. It surprised me how the spool up was also. I didn't expect the car to spool so fast. My power band is one of the greatest I've seen I make power all the way up to my 8000 rpm limit. But I will post the graphs soon.
Wow! That's like baking your cake and eating it too. I'd love to see your car in person and/or see some dyno charts if you have them. The kind of low end spool you're talking about is pretty awesome.

Full Function
01-31-2006, 02:45 PM
Hey guys,

This is Jerry from Full Function. I'm trying to dig up Abe's dyno charts. But his car indeed did make 372 on a Mustang AWD dyno (ours). This was done on regular pump 91 octane with no meth/alky injection. Stay tuned for the dyno results...

Jerry

1StockEvo
01-31-2006, 03:08 PM
Thanks Jerry. I can't seem to find my dyno charts.

Steiner
01-31-2006, 04:27 PM
subscribed for dyno charts!

1StockEvo
02-01-2006, 11:11 PM
Here are the dyno charts. These charts are base tune charts without the cams dialed in and all were done on 91 octane petrol.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/abedatasheet.jpg

1StockEvo
02-01-2006, 11:13 PM
This is the chart 4 above. AFR is very conservative and this base tune was done with no cam adjustment.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/ABEChart.jpg

1StockEvo
02-01-2006, 11:17 PM
This is the base tune that has been in the car. This is with cams set to -2,-2.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/abesdynochart.jpg

Black_EVO
02-01-2006, 11:20 PM
I'm no expert but looks nice. Looks like it pulls and pulls till just before redline. Awsome.

1StockEvo
02-01-2006, 11:20 PM
These dyno charts were all my base tune maps with little under 3hrs of tuning if not less. I am still trying to locate one more chart. Jerry or I will go into more detail 2morrow on the charts.

earlyapex
02-02-2006, 12:57 AM
Do you have any actual dyno chart for this because none of the dyno charts you posted match these numbers:

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/abedatasheet.jpg

GokuSSJ4
02-02-2006, 01:36 AM
why are the tq #'s so low ? :shock:

jeffreywrc
02-02-2006, 02:33 AM
gom ba day~~~abe :D

gom ba day~~~abe :D

earlyapex
02-02-2006, 11:25 AM
why are the tq #'s so low ? :shock:

I was thinking the same thing, but remember these are 91 tunes so you can't run high boost where these larger turbos shine.

They do however look a tad low on trq compared to other GT30's I have seen on pump.

1StockEvo
02-09-2006, 09:23 PM
why are the tq #'s so low ? :shock:

I was thinking the same thing, but remember these are 91 tunes so you can't run high boost where these larger turbos shine.

They do however look a tad low on trq compared to other GT30's I have seen on pump.

Yes the tq #'s are a tad low due to not dialing the cams in and only having a few hours of tuning into it. As for running high boost on 91 any thing is possible as long as the tune is safe. I will most likely be running around 23-26 psi on 91 and probablly around 30 with my alky/meth injection in conjunction with my final tunes. Although this turbo is slightly on the larger side it shines through out my whole power band from beginning to end and not just on high boost.

1StockEvo
02-09-2006, 09:26 PM
I have included some more dyno charts from my car but running on the dynapacks at my work. Our dynapack is very close to Gruppe-S mustang dyno and is only off by 1-3 hp according to Mike.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/WHP.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/boost.jpg[/img]

GST
02-10-2006, 12:34 AM
I have included some more dyno charts from my car but running on the dynapacks at my work. Our dynapack is very close to Gruppe-S mustang dyno and is only off by 1-3 hp according to Mike.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/WHP.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/boost.jpg[/img]

Mike who?

Isn't that flywheel HP and torque?

Mike

1StockEvo
02-10-2006, 02:37 PM
For some reason that is how dynapack lists poweron their graphs. Technically the dynapack reads hp and tq at the hubs of the vehicle. The Mike I am referring to is the tuner at Gruppe-S. I was just posting a few more of my graphs for comparison from the mustang dyno and the dynapack. I wanted to the power and torque curves from my set up.

GST
02-10-2006, 03:04 PM
For some reason that is how dynapack lists poweron their graphs. Technically the dynapack reads hp and tq at the hubs of the vehicle. The Mike I am referring to is the tuner at Gruppe-S. I was just posting a few more of my graphs for comparison from the mustang dyno and the dynapack. I wanted to the power and torque curves from my set up.

Ah that would mean Mike as in me, interesting I have never dyno'd anything on a DynoPack ever.

1StockEvo
02-10-2006, 05:42 PM
No you never did but we dynoed Josh's red evo with the meth injection a few days after you tuned it on your Mustang dyno and then talked to Beau.

GST
02-10-2006, 06:04 PM
No you never did but we dynoed Josh's red evo with the meth injection a few days after you tuned it on your Mustang dyno and then talked to Beau.

Ah, I was going to say that's weird if I'm being quoted as saying something by someone I have never spoken too (refering to you not Beau) but I did speak to Beau and agree it seemed like the numbers were inline although if any form of temp corrections are used then they will fall out of line as quickly as they are inline (we don't have any temp correction installed at all)

Mike

earlyapex
02-12-2006, 09:01 PM
As for running high boost on 91 any thing is possible as long as the tune is safe.

Oh cool, care to show how you figured out how to raise the effective octane rating of 91 octane fuel with a tune?





I will most likely be running around 23-26 psi on 91

26psi on 91? See above.

earlyapex
02-12-2006, 09:02 PM
I have included some more dyno charts from my car but running on the dynapacks at my work.

have any uncorrected numbers?

GokuSSJ4
02-13-2006, 12:33 AM
from my understanding it rates things at the hub and not at the wheels, which means that it shows a lot less hp lost.
i use to use a dynopack awhile ago, but i dont think anyone or hardly anyone uses or has dyno in one

smack
02-13-2006, 12:42 AM
i can say that i ran my car at srm and pulled 280whp.
the next day i ran at gruppe-s and pulled 275whp.
i think that gruppe-s was about 25lbs lower on torque though.

GokuSSJ4
02-13-2006, 12:43 AM
i can say that i ran my car at srm and pulled 280whp.
the next day i ran at gruppe-s and pulled 275whp.
i think that gruppe-s was about 25lbs lower on torque though.
i guess mustang dynos read that low then, never have used one..
its mainly a dd or a dj

earlyapex
02-13-2006, 11:59 AM
i can say that i ran my car at srm and pulled 280whp.
the next day i ran at gruppe-s and pulled 275whp.
i think that gruppe-s was about 25lbs lower on torque though.

Yea gruppe-s MD dyno seems to read really low on torque compared to even the EIP MD dyno.

earlyapex
02-13-2006, 03:00 PM
uncorrected numbers 1StockEvo?

1StockEvo
02-13-2006, 11:53 PM
uncorrected numbers 1StockEvo?

Here you go.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/1StockEvo/whpnocorrection1.jpg

EVO GRIM
02-14-2006, 08:01 AM
Why does it say flywheel hp and tq? Seams like it adds 20% to give you that total. I'd like to see this car dynoed on gruppes or eip's dyno to cross reference.

1StockEvo
02-14-2006, 01:09 PM
Why does it say flywheel hp and tq? Seams like it adds 20% to give you that total. I'd like to see this car dynoed on gruppes or eip's dyno to cross reference.

To my understanding Gruppe-S and Full Function's(pg.2 charts)Mustang dyno read nearly the same. As far as Eip's dyno I am not really sure. As soon as my final tune is done I might head over to Gruppe-S to run a base dyno so everyone on here will believe and stop doubting everything.

earlyapex
02-14-2006, 01:24 PM
As soon as my final tune is done I might head over to Gruppe-S to run a base dyno so everyone on here will believe and stop doubting everything.


Yes please do. Questioning things is good.

You have to realize that these results are bound to raise questions since the performance is better than every other 30series kit out there right now.

Gruppe-S
02-16-2006, 01:43 AM
300whp would be an admirable goal for the stock EVO VIII turbo on 91 octane. We just finished tuning out the EVO IX turbo. Made 300whp, (I don't think there is a single stock turbo EVO VIII making 300whp on our dyno). The turbo should be worth about 310whp on 91 octane on a 272 / uncatted car. :)

BTW, the Bozz EVO with the HKS GT3037, C16 race gas, and an aggressive tune (HKS V-Pro) made 410whp on our dyno. :)

earlyapex
02-16-2006, 11:38 AM
(I don't think there is a single stock turbo EVO VIII making 300whp on our dyno).

303whp here.

301whp/287wtq final tune on 91 octane. 05 turbo. :)

mods in sig. :wink: