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View Full Version : Opinion on intakes



kimmievo
04-19-2004, 09:09 PM
Hey everyone,

I am getting ready to purchase an intake system for the evo and I wanted everyones opinion on the two I have narrowed it down to.

I was either going to get an AEM short ram intake or the HKS racing suction intake. I am leaning more towards the HKS.

Does anyone have one of these two? What do you think of it?
Any advice or info about the two would be helpful.

Thanks,
Kim

warpspeed
04-19-2004, 09:16 PM
Both of those intake are good. The only thing you have to worry about is that(as far as I know) they don't have any C.A.R.B. # on them :( so if the cops pulls you over and checks your motor, they will tell you to take it off because of legality. I heard from alot of people about the new K&N Typhoon intake for the Evo and it does have a C.A.R.B. # on them. :D

SilverBullet
04-19-2004, 09:18 PM
Well, from what I heard the AEM short ram's heat shield tends to crack and the HKS RS is a good intake but NO c.a.r.b # and its $$$...I have the K&N typhoon intake which has a c.a.r.b # and is built well....o ya and the K&N sounds good and looks good and it comes with a carbon heat shield... :wink:

JanSolo
04-19-2004, 09:26 PM
But I believe you lose some low end torque by buying a new intake.

brwnrice
04-19-2004, 09:39 PM
works says that the stock air induction box is well engineered that if you are planning on staying with the stock 16g turbo. just buy a k&n drop in and your good to go.

evo_dadi
04-19-2004, 11:18 PM
aem just got their intake carb approved but not sure if they are gonna help out past buyers.i had the aem before but went back to the stock box with an RMR intake pipe instead.id rather have my low end ready than going all the way high to pick up a few ponies.

kimmievo
04-19-2004, 11:24 PM
Yeah, I was on the AEM website awhile back, and I noticed the Short Ram was pending a C.A.R.B. #. I guess they finally got around to it. I don't really want to lose any low-end torque, so I'll just have to sleep on this for a little while. In the meantime, I've got lots of other mods to do.

methods4
04-20-2004, 04:49 PM
But I believe you lose some low end torque by buying a new intake.

Yup. It is a noticable difference. I installed an RMR intake on my car a while back. And even though it made cool sounds and stuff, I lost a lot of bottom end. The top end gains weren't significant enough for me to keep it. Bottom end is pretty important to me when my car spends 90% of it's life on the street. I ditched the open intake and went with a Ralliart drop-in. I now have my bottom end back. All is good. :wink:

EvoKach
04-20-2004, 07:26 PM
I agree with the small loss of low end but it does help the turbo the spool a little faster. However, if I could do it all over again, I would prefer a drop-in for $40-$70 rather then the $200 for the AEM.

warpspeed
04-20-2004, 07:35 PM
I agree with the small loss of low end but it does help the turbo the spool a little faster. However, if I could do it all over again, I would prefer a drop-in for $40-$70 rather then the $200 for the AEM.
That's why I tell my friends before buying something for their cars. Do research on the part/s before you buy or else you will regret it. :wink:

EvoKach
04-20-2004, 07:45 PM
I wouldn't say I regret it and I would just have bought a drop-in and spent the other $160 on something else. I'm happy with my purchase and for an intake system, I'm happy with it especially after noticing that I got better gas milage with it.

warpspeed
04-20-2004, 07:51 PM
Just aquick question. Does the AEM have a C.A.R.B. # on it?

vtluu
04-20-2004, 08:08 PM
Just aquick question. Does the AEM have a C.A.R.B. # on it?
Yes! CARB Executive Order # D-392-21, for A.E.M. part # 22-435.

Look it up at: http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/amquery.php

crapsstickman
04-22-2004, 08:58 PM
I too was leading toward the HKS racing suction. But I heard that you should stick with the plastic piping rather than the stainless pipe. The heat conducted to the metal pipe alone would drop your power a little. Does anyone have knowledge if this is true or not?

lambtron
04-22-2004, 09:12 PM
I wouldn't reccommend an aftermarket intake.

vtluu
04-22-2004, 09:18 PM
I wouldn't reccommend an aftermarket intake.
Care to elaborate? :?

lambtron
04-22-2004, 09:33 PM
When you mess with the airflow to the MAF, it freaks out and makes your car run shitty, although it may not be immediately noticeable, throw the car on a dyno and your curve will look like a fucked up mountain range. You really only gain from an aftermarket intake when you get a custom tune.

EvoKach
04-22-2004, 10:25 PM
Lambtron - When you say shitty.....do you mean a stuttering and/or lack of acceleration? Sometimes I feel like I'm overloading with air especially if I pass between trucks or I'm on a real windy section of road. My car runs great 95% of the time and especially around town....but in 5th gear on a windy road it sucks. The cone on the AEM is gigantic.

559EVO
04-23-2004, 01:20 AM
Stock airbox works fine for me.

BramellS4
04-23-2004, 01:23 AM
A friend showed me this, and i figured i had to respond. In any event, i read here every once in a while, as i am selling my car at some point for an evo.

So...i dont drive an evo, but i do know a thing or two about engine management systems. Engine mgnt. systems have many many fail safes these days. Each fail safe works to "protect" the motor. These fail safes, while nice often present many problems when trying to tune a car. Ecus cross check values against each other to check for "problems." If ECU doesn’t believe what it sees, it will fall onto a safety map. The safety map runs much less aggressive, as to protect the motor. The safety map also ignores sensor inputs, and runs off of a set of calculations.

With that said, one thing the ecu checks is the MAP sensor reading vs. the MAF reading. As i mentioned above, if it sees a MAF value it doesn’t believe at the given boost, it will fall onto the safety map. So, where does an intake system come into play in all of this?

The factory intake system is designed to feed a smooth straight air stream. The MAF is calibrated to read this STRAIGHT air stream. Aftermarket intakes often cause turbulence before the MAF. Causing turbulence before the MAF will introduce false MAF readings. These readings are often Jumpy, and in many cases too high. When the MAF reading is too high for the MAP reading, the ECU falls onto that safety map i was talking about earlier. For example, if a car flows 300 GPS at 17 pounds of boost on the factory intake. This same car with this same boost may think its seeing 320 grams on an aftermarket intake. This false reading trips the ecu onto the safety map.

So, i know what some of you are going to say..."The higher reading is because the intake is working."

In response to this, i offer you this:

In order for a MAF to work correctly, turbulence must be at as low of a level as possible. Aftermarket intakes create swirling, which causes the artificially high numbers. The reason the turbulence is introduced happens for a number of reasons: Cone filters swirl air, their isnt enough straight tubing before the maf, the list goes on and on.

The bottom line is this: Aftermarket intakes do more harm then good on lightly, even sometimes heavy modified cars. Today’s factory air boxes are often good for a HUGE amount of power, so stick with them. The money is better spent on engine mods that make a difference, such as reflashes, exhausts, turbos, so on and so on.

If you don’t believe me that’s fine, YOUR performance will be the one melting down faster then an igloo in the Sahara, not mine.

559EVO
04-23-2004, 01:28 AM
For that being your first post,that's a huge writeup :thumbsup:
Welcome to the club.

A friend showed me this, and i figured i had to respond. In any event, i read here every once in a while, as i am selling my car at some point for an evo.

So...i dont drive an evo, but i do know a thing or two about engine management systems. Engine mgnt. systems have many many fail safes these days. Each fail safe works to "protect" the motor. These fail safes, while nice often present many problems when trying to tune a car. Ecus cross check values against each other to check for "problems." If ECU doesn’t believe what it sees, it will fall onto a safety map. The safety map runs much less aggressive, as to protect the motor. The safety map also ignores sensor inputs, and runs off of a set of calculations.

With that said, one thing the ecu checks is the MAP sensor reading vs. the MAF reading. As i mentioned above, if it sees a MAF value it doesn’t believe at the given boost, it will fall onto the safety map. So, where does an intake system come into play in all of this?

The factory intake system is designed to feed a smooth straight air stream. The MAF is calibrated to read this STRAIGHT air stream. Aftermarket intakes often cause turbulence before the MAF. Causing turbulence before the MAF will introduce false MAF readings. These readings are often Jumpy, and in many cases too high. When the MAF reading is too high for the MAP reading, the ECU falls onto that safety map i was talking about earlier. For example, if a car flows 300 GPS at 17 pounds of boost on the factory intake. This same car with this same boost may think its seeing 320 grams on an aftermarket intake. This false reading trips the ecu onto the safety map.

So, i know what some of you are going to say..."The higher reading is because the intake is working."

In response to this, i offer you this:

In order for a MAF to work correctly, turbulence must be at as low of a level as possible. Aftermarket intakes create swirling, which causes the artificially high numbers. The reason the turbulence is introduced happens for a number of reasons: Cone filters swirl air, their isnt enough straight tubing before the maf, the list goes on and on.

The bottom line is this: Aftermarket intakes do more harm then good on lightly, even sometimes heavy modified cars. Today’s factory air boxes are often good for a HUGE amount of power, so stick with them. The money is better spent on engine mods that make a difference, such as reflashes, exhausts, turbos, so on and so on.

If you don’t believe me that’s fine, YOUR performance will be the one melting down faster then an igloo in the Sahara, not mine.

BramellS4
04-23-2004, 01:29 AM
Hehe...i am a car lover, what can i say? :oops:

lambtron
04-23-2004, 09:02 AM
Bram's car made 355 on our dyno :shock:

EvolvedDSM
04-23-2004, 02:00 PM
That's fine and all, but how do you account for the honeycombs? After all, this is what straightens up the airflow prior to the sensor itself. You're implying that an intake will somehow nullify this. I've brought up my thoughts before: http://www.norcalevo.net/forums/viewtopic.php?p=11297&highlight=#11297

I'd still like to see some logs to validate these claims (stock box vs open element). Something with airflow, timing, duty cycle/pulse width and O2 (an accompanying dyno chart w/ a wideband would be the icing on the cake). Until then, I won't be convinced.

BTW I used to run a 2G MAS w/ half the honeycombs missing, an open element filter and no headlight.
http://www.columbusdsm.com/forum/files/97awd2.jpg
The filter sat right next to the white overflow bottle in the pic (talk about turbulance). I used an SAFC to correct at the 1k through 3K Ne-points on the low setting just to keep the thing idling. High settings and everything on the low end from 3K up were either zeros or +/-1%. Absolutely no driveability problems and 13.577 on that stock T-too-small.