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evo8dustu
06-08-2006, 10:54 PM
does anybody run their evo on it for daily driving? gas has gone up so high, i jsut started filling my car with 87 octane to commute from home to school. do you guys think its ok to run it on 87 just for daily driving? i havnt noticed or herd any pinging or anything so i figured it would be ok as long as i stayed off the boost.

EFIxMR
06-08-2006, 11:04 PM
as long as you stay out of boost and don't put too much load on the engine you *should* be ok.

EFIxMR
06-08-2006, 11:05 PM
however, the next time you fill with 91, your octane will be diluted. so becareful. not sure how long it would take for you to flush all that junk gas completely out of your system.

ace33joe
06-09-2006, 02:14 PM
I believe 87 octane will give you less mileage also. I don't think you will save much money by going 87. If I were you, I would try to save fuel to save money or get another vehicle designed for 87 with good mileage.

ZK
06-09-2006, 02:35 PM
I believe 87 octane will give you less mileage also. I don't think you will save much money by going 87. If I were you, I would try to save fuel to save money or get another vehicle designed for 87 with good mileage.


My friends and I had a new Lexus RX330 loaner car and took that thing to Vegas for the weekend. Required 91 octane but we pumped 87 the whole way. The car ran noticably worse, acceleration lacked power and lumpy and gas mileage was terrible.

It got us to and from Vegas though. We were cranking the A/C in 100 degree weather, lots of WOT runs on the highway on ramps, hauling 5 people and luggage with no problems.

BaseModelEvo
06-09-2006, 02:42 PM
you guys are risking your motors to save a couple dollars? why did you buy Evos if gas was a concern?

Running 87 will run your car dangerously close to knock tolerances. You will most likely hit limp mode the first time you plant your foot. It takes about 1/18th of a second to melt your motor or blow a hole in a piston by running lean/detonating/pre-igniting.

Get that shit out of your car and put 91 octane in it. If you want something economical, buy a Honda. $0.20 difference between 91 and 87....really that pressed for the 20 cents that you'd risk a motor?

EvoRicer
06-09-2006, 04:49 PM
My friends and I had a new Lexus RX330 loaner car and took that thing to Vegas for the weekend. Required 91 octane but we pumped 87 the whole way. The car ran noticably worse, acceleration lacked power and lumpy and gas mileage was terrible.

It got us to and from Vegas though. We were cranking the A/C in 100 degree weather, lots of WOT runs on the highway on ramps, hauling 5 people and luggage with no problems.


Yea...that's a loaner car. If it was your car, I don't think you would abuse it like that...

Matz
06-09-2006, 05:12 PM
My friends and I had a new Lexus RX330 loaner car and took that thing to Vegas for the weekend. Required 91 octane but we pumped 87 the whole way. The car ran noticably worse, acceleration lacked power and lumpy and gas mileage was terrible.

It got us to and from Vegas though. We were cranking the A/C in 100 degree weather, lots of WOT runs on the highway on ramps, hauling 5 people and luggage with no problems.


Yea...that's a loaner car. If it was your car, I don't think you would abuse it like that...


I run 87 octane in my MDX which "requires" 91 octane, and I haven't had a single problem in 3 years.

* Matz knocks on wood

BaseModelEvo
06-09-2006, 05:16 PM
Honda has ignition timing on lock... be carefull homey. Plus it's NA...it will learn not to run aggressive maps. Turbos create high cylinder pressure regardless. Which creates pre-ignition and detonation. I think it's nuts...but good luck...

BMan
06-11-2006, 02:25 PM
8)

xxx4reggie
06-11-2006, 07:15 PM
Um wow, you guys are really risky your Evo's man

my bro has a Honda, 4 banger accord and it's required 87 but he filsl with 91. I have a V6 and I fill with 91 from time to time.
Honda's can take the 87 89 or 91 cuz well it's a honda engine, lol.
My friend who is fuken cheap ass filles with Costco piss gas 87 on his TL-S which required only 91 and that thing runs great!!

But this is an Evo we are talking about, A Perfomarnce car, not just another regular car. I think you guys should only do 91 but it's your car so it's up to you.

evo_dadi
06-11-2006, 07:23 PM
lol i gas at costco from time to time,but i fill it up with 91.

twEeker
06-11-2006, 09:07 PM
Is saving an extra few dollars really worth putting 87 in your tank? Its your car, but I mean if your so broke you cant spend a just a little bit more on decent gas, then maybe you should sell the evo. Thats what I would do. Yeah it sucks having to pay a little more when gas prices go up, but I think everyone makes a bigger deal of it then it really is.

evo8dustu
06-11-2006, 09:49 PM
okay, is there any proof that u guys can show that putting 91 instead of 87 in ur cars makes a huge diffrence. i am for putting 91 in our cars, but i have a fried with an sti who has used 87 octane from the day he bought it. he tells me gas is gas and theyre all the same. he says he doesnt feel any difrence when using 91 and 87, and when both of our cars were stock, we raced and he beat me from roll so he is hardheaded about using 87. i tell him to add 91, but he doesnt feel its necesary. so if anybody could give me some proof that i can show him that would prove that 91 is a must would be great.

xxx4reggie
06-11-2006, 10:01 PM
okay, is there any proof that u guys can show that putting 91 instead of 87 in ur cars makes a huge diffrence. i am for putting 91 in our cars, but i have a fried with an sti who has used 87 octane from the day he bought it. he tells me gas is gas and theyre all the same. he says he doesnt feel any difrence when using 91 and 87, and when both of our cars were stock, we raced and he beat me from roll so he is hardheaded about using 87. i tell him to add 91, but he doesnt feel its necesary. so if anybody could give me some proof that i can show him that would prove that 91 is a must would be great.


lol
dude I have a honda and I can feel the difference with 87 and 91. When I had a Unchip in it and set that thing to 91 map, I only used 91. Why? cuz when I did 87, it started pinging and later one.....lets just say it cost me in the long run *cough* over a grand *cough*. Now I wish I wasnt cheap to save 20 cents :(

Again, it's his car (a subby) so he can fill with what octane he wants BUT as an Evo enthusiast, DONT USE 87!! Unless you are wiling to take the risk.

To me its like using regular motor oil instead of syn oil.
Same concept, save a few dollars but in the long run, f that mofo up!!

Would you be willing to use regular oil in your Evo instead of synch? If the answer is no then the same should go for fuel.
(This comment isnt pointed to you but to everyone who is using 87 on their Evo)

ace33joe
06-12-2006, 01:05 AM
Here is a good article about octane.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/3604/regular-or-premium.html

As the article says, I believe you should use what manufacturer recommends for that specific engine/vehicle. If EVOs were designed to run 87, I would use 87.

As the article says, as long as you meet the minimum octane rating (most cases either 86 or 87), you won't damage engine. 2003 Evo owner's manual also says EVO is optimized for 98 RON (Research Octane Number, which is around ~93 AKI (anti knock index used in US, =(RON+MON)/2)), but EVO will run with 87 AKI with reduced performance. It means we still don't get the full potential even when we run 91 octane here in California.

Whatever people do with their car is up to them. But if I didn't plan to use my vehicle's performance 100% (although I can't with 91 octane still) to save couple of bucks every fill, I wouldn't buy an EVO.

MitsuMan
06-12-2006, 07:48 AM
well thats weird I posted on this thread near the begining saying that 87 would be ok as long as he doesn't push his car and drive it hard, and some other stuff about fuel and now its gone. WTF? ol well

dohcvtec
06-12-2006, 12:11 PM
Maybe a vendor deleted it?
:lol:

ek9_evo9
06-12-2006, 12:21 PM
Maybe a vendor deleted it?
:lol:


:lol: :lol:

EvoKid
06-12-2006, 01:50 PM
I always though 91 wasnt even good enough for my EVO.

Cars like the EVO and STi really need 93.

Richie Rich
06-12-2006, 03:29 PM
100 is the way to go hheheheh

BMan
06-12-2006, 03:58 PM
It's all about the tune. I had a '97 T-bird 4.6l (said to be a 87 octane engine without knock sensors) that I had reprogramed for power. When I went to visit family in SoCal I put 91 in it and it pinged so bad I had to add toluene to bring the octane up. Now the EVO has knock sensors and the ECU has several maps in it to protect the engine. No you won't be able to keep big power on low octane, or use a boost controler to up the boost, but it can be driven GENTLY.
If you add cams, intake, and high boost with no tune, all bets are off.

xxx4reggie
06-12-2006, 04:57 PM
100 is the way to go hheheheh


Where, where
for the love of god, where!!

Richie Rich
06-12-2006, 06:28 PM
My buddy got a supply of 110 lead or 100 unleaded drums i think its 6bucks a gallon.
His at 10th street san jose.(philwood.com)

87 high REv motor turbo charge i wont gamblle my MR. i love my car to much.
Plus i have a lead foot : ).

Get a beater and put 87 with no worry.

EvoRicer
06-12-2006, 08:25 PM
xxx4reggie, there is a 76 Station that sells 100 Octane. It's on Watt...I don't know the cross street though. hahaha.

whtrice
06-12-2006, 08:29 PM
76 on corner of Watt and Marconi..$6.50 a gal......

xxx4reggie, there is a 76 Station that sells 100 Octane. It's on Watt...I don't know the cross street though. hahaha.

xxx4reggie
06-12-2006, 10:25 PM
EvoRicer and Whtrice, thanks!!
I have to check that out. lol I wonder what'll happen if I filled that to my beater accord
ooooooooooooooooooo :D
Watt and Marconi huh. I HAVE to go :)

ok which one?
1. 2849 WATT AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821
2. 2549 MARCONI AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821

evo8dustu
06-12-2006, 10:32 PM
so if a car says specifically says to use 87 octane, and u use say 91 or 100, it wont damage it?

EvoRicer
06-13-2006, 01:21 AM
EvoRicer and Whtrice, thanks!!
I have to check that out. lol I wonder what'll happen if I filled that to my beater accord
ooooooooooooooooooo :D
Watt and Marconi huh. I HAVE to go :)

ok which one?
1. 2849 WATT AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821
2. 2549 MARCONI AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821


Try the Watt one. The front of the Station faces Watt and not Marconi.



so if a car says specifically says to use 87 octane, and u use say 91 or 100, it wont damage it?


It shouldn't...higher Octane is boosting performance. Lower Octane downgrades performance.

ek9_evo9
06-13-2006, 07:21 AM
so if a car says specifically says to use 87 octane, and u use say 91 or 100, it wont damage it?


no, higher octane rating means the gasoline burns cleaner.

if your car is rated 87 octane, you can use 100 all you want. question is why? thats a tremendous waste of money!

i fill up my 00 civic hatchback with 87 because i dont see a need for higher octane fuel on a 1.5L car with no vtec.

xxx4reggie
06-13-2006, 08:21 AM
i fill up my 00 civic hatchback with 87 because i dont see a need for higher octane fuel on a 1.5L car with no vtec.


I fill with 87 cuz mine dont have a knock sensor, lol. At least with the chip it was tuned to use that map but no chips means back to my cheap ways
:lol:

ace33joe
06-13-2006, 08:26 AM
You won't get better performance by using 91 or 100 if the engine is made (or tuned) for 87 octane. Take a look at the Car and Driver article I posted, it says stock Honda Accord even showed less performance on 91 octane.

Higher octane does not mean it burns stronger or cleaner. It just does not ignite by itself during compression cycle.

Some people tell their cars (made for 87) did show improved performance on 91, then usually it means you had knocking on 87 (although ECU pulls timing even you feel knocking) mostly because of poor maintenance.

Usually old cars with high mileage requires higher octane, because carbon build up in combustion chamber causes "hot spot" to ignite the air/fuel mixture or carbon on piston head makes "higher compression" (also reduces the total displacement).

Anyhow, I wish we can have 93 octane fuel in California so that I don't have to mix octane 100 which has limited availability.




EvoRicer and Whtrice, thanks!!
I have to check that out. lol I wonder what'll happen if I filled that to my beater accord
ooooooooooooooooooo :D
Watt and Marconi huh. I HAVE to go :)

ok which one?
1. 2849 WATT AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821
2. 2549 MARCONI AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821

xxx4reggie
06-13-2006, 08:46 AM
You won't get better performance by using 91 or 100 if the engine is made (or tuned) for 87 octane. Take a look at the Car and Driver article I posted, it says stock Honda Accord even showed less performance on 91 octane.


+1, the stock honda accord 6th gen v6 will get less perfomance with anything over 87. But i'll be using that 100 octance on my bro's 4 banger :D
Watch that 150 hp accord smoke and rape me :lol: :(

AreSTG
06-14-2006, 12:08 PM
i rememebr on EvoM a guy had blamed his engine blowing up on having 87 instead of super(93octane, it was NJ).

In NJ you dont pump your own gas, its like state law or some gay shit.

he said either 93 or 94, he got 87, 1 block later boom. Granted it was a tuned car and for sure tuned for 93.

evo8dustu
06-14-2006, 12:12 PM
quote author=AreSTG link=topic=10686.msg143113#msg143113 date=1150312093]In NJ you dont pump your own gas, its like state law or some gay shit.



yeah i know,oregon is like that too. they make the staff pump ur gas, not sure why, maybe because they are worried about the enviornment?

KareBearPowa
06-14-2006, 12:13 PM
he said either 93 or 94, he got 87, 1 block later boom. Granted it was a tuned car and for sure tuned for 93.


One of the many reasons tuning the low-octane maps the same as the high-octane maps are a bad bad idea.

ek9_evo9
06-14-2006, 12:30 PM
quote author=AreSTG link=topic=10686.msg143113#msg143113 date=1150312093]In NJ you dont pump your own gas, its like state law or some gay shit.



yeah i know,oregon is like that too. they make the staff pump ur gas, not sure why, maybe because they are worried about the enviornment?




no, it creates more jobs...thats the only reason why.

xxx4reggie
06-14-2006, 12:50 PM
why cant cali have people pumping gas, man I would be hella lazy then!!
=(

ek9_evo9
06-14-2006, 01:43 PM
why cant cali have people pumping gas, man I would be hella lazy then!!
=(




i dont trust anyone else to do it, california probably has the highest percentage of idiots compared to other states. can you imagine some 16 year old kid who doesnt know crap trying to pump gas in your car?

i was in NJ and went to gas up my moms accord, got out of the car and some guy came up and asked me if i needed anything...he had this weird look on his face, i told him i was going to get gas he said he pumps my gas for me i was like WTF? he also went in and got me my soda and chips and cigs....that was weirder than dried shit

xxx4reggie
06-14-2006, 02:27 PM
why cant cali have people pumping gas, man I would be hella lazy then!!
=(



i dont trust anyone else to do it, california probably has the highest percentage of idiots compared to other states.
lol

ZK
06-14-2006, 02:50 PM
i was in NJ and went to gas up my moms accord, got out of the car and some guy came up and asked me if i needed anything...he had this weird look on his face, i told him i was going to get gas he said he pumps my gas for me i was like WTF? he also went in and got me my soda and chips and cigs....that was weirder than dried shit


I think in some states over there it is a requirement that someone pump your gas or something. They used to have full service where people pump your gas in CA. They got rid of it.

I went to a gas station in SF last month and this guy working there runs up to me and asks me what kind of gas I need. I ask him if it was full service? He says it is "free service". I thank him and and tell him I'm going to pump my own gas. Nice thought but it's wierd handing someone a credit card and having them pump for you.

At the gas stations in Japan and Taiwan, they always pump your gas for you. I actually would trust those guys to do it too.

BaseModelEvo
06-15-2006, 10:06 AM
no, higher octane rating means the gasoline burns cleaner.

if your car is rated 87 octane, you can use 100 all you want. question is why? thats a tremendous waste of money!

i fill up my 00 civic hatchback with 87 because i dont see a need for higher octane fuel on a 1.5L car with no vtec.


No, a car does NOT run cleaner or burn cleaner depending on the gasoline you put in. the difference between 87 and 91 octane is 40 points. Each octane number being 10 points in the AKI (Anti-knock-index). 87 is designed to light off at a lower spark temp. This means you put it in a car in which the combustion chamber is reaching temperatures above spark point and you WILL detonate. In fact, nearly all cars detonate, just not often enough or early enough to lose the motor or blow a hole in a piston. 91 octane is designed to withstand more cylinder temp and a hotter spark than 87 octane. As air is compressed you get friction, friction = heat.

To answer the next question: So I can put 100 octane in my 87 octane car?

Sure, but it's detrimental. Just as an Evo is meant to burn 91 ATLEAST (hp and performance ratings are actually done on 93 from Mitsu), your car's combustion chamber, timing curve, and fuel map were optimized for 87 octane. Low compression and late timing. By adding 89, 91, 93, etc you simply don't burn the left over fuel. You gum valves, and get carbon deposits. Now granted, going from 87 - 89 seems a small jump, but it's a 20 point difference. While carbon deposits may not be severe, as you raise octane they will build and you'll end up with sticking valve and all sorts of wierd driveability problems down the line.

Last, cause some one will ask. Why is it an Evo can run 100 octane even if it's designed for 93?

The Evolution is optimized for 93 octane, a minimum in countries overseas. The reason we can step it up to 100 now and then is because even on 93 octane the ECM is picking up vibrations from the pizo crystal in the knock sensor. Thus pulling timing, changes maps, changing depending on load, etc. It's optimizing your car to drive it's best based on what it is told by mitsubishi is a "safe" operating range. Because the car runs so much boost, even 93 octane does not fully eliminate detonation. As we put higher octane rated fuel in our car, the car begins to respond and run more agressive maps upping the power further.

i.e. I pick up roughly 3mph and 2/10s of a second in my ET simply fueling with 100 (mixed with 91 = roughly 95 octane).

Once the computer has run it's most aggressive map in the ECM, it wont optimize further. So if peak power is made with pure 97 octane, it's likely 100 octane wont add much more.

I hope this was helpfull, if it was unclear in any way please let me know or PM me for more information.

P.S. It takes about an 1/18th of second to burn a hole in the piston under the exhaust valve during a lean condition. The pocket of air will essentially become a flame thrower and nuke a hole directly below the spark plug. Still wanna save a couple cents?

KareBearPowa
06-15-2006, 11:07 AM
As we put higher octane rated fuel in our car, the car begins to respond and run more agressive maps upping the power further.

i.e. I pick up roughly 3mph and 2/10s of a second in my ET simply fueling with 100 (mixed with 91 = roughly 95 octane).



If the tune is done well you will not find anymore power by just putting a higher octane fuel in with no tune changes. I have seen this about 5x on the dyno. Adding 100 octane, doing a pull and the power either stays the same or sometimes actually goes down.

Now, if the tune of the car was too aggressive that the car was detonating, then yes, adding higher octane fuel will increase power. The only way adding higher octane "would move it into more aggressive maps" is if you either up the boost to increase load or your 91 octane tune is detonating enough that it is dropping into the low octane maps.

If that is true, I would look at the 91 octane tune a but more closely. ;)

This is with a modified car. Stock car could be moving within maps because, like you said, 91 octane is on the low scale for these ecu's with stock tuning.

BaseModelEvo
06-15-2006, 12:29 PM
As we put higher octane rated fuel in our car, the car begins to respond and run more agressive maps upping the power further.

i.e. I pick up roughly 3mph and 2/10s of a second in my ET simply fueling with 100 (mixed with 91 = roughly 95 octane).



If the tune is done well you will not find anymore power by just putting a higher octane fuel in with no tune changes. I have seen this about 5x on the dyno. Adding 100 octane, doing a pull and the power either stays the same or sometimes actually goes down.

Now, if the tune of the car was too aggressive that the car was detonating, then yes, adding higher octane fuel will increase power. The only way adding higher octane "would move it into more aggressive maps" is if you either up the boost to increase load or your 91 octane tune is detonating enough that it is dropping into the low octane maps.

If that is true, I would look at the 91 octane tune a but more closely. ;)

This is with a modified car. Stock car could be moving within maps because, like you said, 91 octane is on the low scale for these ecu's with stock tuning.




Yes I was referring to a STOCK car. The car will use different maps depending on the fuel supplied. Good point APEX. Thanks for clarifying.

Just because a car is tuned, however, doesn't mean octane wont reap more power...if the car is "optimized" for 100 octane (as many of our flashes are) they will run fine with less power on lower AKI fuel. If they are optimized for 91, then yes, adding AKI points will not reap an increase.

FYI - almost 2% of total power from nearly any vehicle is lost through misfire and detonation/pre-ignition so adding octane will nearly ALWAYS reap a small gain.

KareBearPowa
06-15-2006, 12:45 PM
if the car is "optimized" for 100 octane (as many of our flashes are) they will run fine with less power on lower AKI fuel. If they are optimized for 91, then yes, adding AKI points will not reap an increase.



What flashes are optimized for 100 octane? Are you talking about your own flashes or others available?

BaseModelEvo
06-15-2006, 02:20 PM
What flashes are optimized for 100 octane? Are you talking about your own flashes or others available?



Please remember there are more Evos than exist on the forum. Flash is probably a bad word to use. We do several custom tunes for track only Evolutions, STis. The car can run on 91 octane if need be, but it was optimized for 100 octane.

Additionally, there are several flashes that run better on higher octane. Flashing a car to an increased boost level will raise cylinder temp/pressure and light off 91 octane like crazy. If the detonation becomes too severe the ECM will fail you into a "limp" mode until the condition ceases. If the condition is not deemed dangerous by the ECM it will retard timing until the detonation dissipates.

whtrice
06-15-2006, 04:53 PM
I am kinda new to EVO's but not cars. Have run alot of high compression vehicles over the years and here in Cali I have always gotten a beni from running a higher octane of fuel when the temps get above 95 degress. Under hood temps always skyrocket at that time. I know in the carb days the gas would boil in the bowls of the carb and vapor lock. No fun.

So now that we run high pressure fuel rails with injectors I am guessing this problem is not existant? I assume 91 octane is still good for putzin but if its hot and you wanna run at the track
100 will still give you a performance beni. So regardless of map does this still hold true??

Anyone that runs the track on hot summer days can probably answer this one..thanks!!!

KareBearPowa
06-15-2006, 05:08 PM
Please remember there are more Evos than exist on the forum. Flash is probably a bad word to use. We do several custom tunes for track only Evolutions, STis. The car can run on 91 octane if need be, but it was optimized for 100 octane.

First sentence I have no idea what you meant by it. Why is flash a bad word? That is what they are called. How can a car be optimized for 100 octane but safely run on 91 octane?



Additionally, there are several flashes that run better on higher octane. Flashing a car to an increased boost level will raise cylinder temp/pressure and light off 91 octane like crazy. If the detonation becomes too severe the ECM will fail you into a "limp" mode until the condition ceases. If the condition is not deemed dangerous by the ECM it will retard timing until the detonation dissipates.


ok, like what flashes? And thanks for letting me know how the ECU works. :lol:

BaseModelEvo
06-15-2006, 05:30 PM
More resistance to detonation allows for MORE timing. Hence... tune for 100 octane and you can run more advance.

If you run 91 the car will simply retard the timing and lose performance.

EcuTek allows for optimizing for different fuels while still being able to run a lower grade at the risk of less performance, and possible motor "termination."

I called it a tune, because TUNING is changing parameters while ON the dyno, flashing is plugging in, downloading a new map, off you go.

So NO, they're not ALL called flashes. There's TUNING, and there's FLASHES.

KareBearPowa
06-15-2006, 05:36 PM
More resistance to detonation allows for MORE timing. Hence... tune for 100 octane and you can run more advance.

If you run 91 the car will simply retard the timing and lose performance.

First off, thank you for finally answering some of my questions. So you tune the low-octane map for 91 octane and the high-octane map for 100 octane? So you use big multiple knock events for your "dual-map" tuning?



EcuTek allows for optimizing for different fuels while still being able to run a lower grade at the risk of less performance, and possible motor "termination."

Yes I know the maps in ECUtek



I called it a tune, because TUNING is changing parameters while ON the dyno, flashing is plugging in, downloading a new map, off you go.

So NO, they're not ALL called flashes. There's TUNING, and there's FLASHES.

All flashes are tuned at some point, now you are moving into custom tuned flashes and off-the shelf tuned flashes. Overall, they all flash the ECU and change the parameters. WORKS would disagree with you on the "on the dyno" part though. ;)



Do you actually know anything about cars, APEX, or do you simply "GOOGLE" like non-stop?


I strongly suggest you do some searching on the board if you are going to pull that card on me.

evo_dadi
06-15-2006, 05:37 PM
i always thought when they "flash" your car that a tune being re-programmed to the car's ecu.flash=reflash just in case youre getting confused with it ;)

BaseModelEvo
06-15-2006, 05:41 PM
You just repeated everything I told you. If you knew I was right (and I was), why are you constantly arguing with me?

Every thread you involve yourself in some how turns to an arguement because you have to be the smartest guy on this forum. his question was on running crappy gas in a car not designed to run it. It's not smart. Plain and simple. Start a thread on "Dual Map" tuning if you'd like to discuss this. I'm done arguing. You obviously have some sort of "I've gotta be smarter" complex and it's pathetic. Keeping Googling.

Flashes are TUNED...but getting your car flashed is NOT getting it tuned. Every car, same make same model, same motor, same mods will respond differently. TUNING and FLASHING are two different worlds. Flashes are generic and very conservative. Tunes can be anything from radical to conservative depending on owner preference.

KareBearPowa
06-15-2006, 05:44 PM
You just repeated everything I told you. If you knew I was right (and I was), why are you constantly arguing with me?

Every thread you involve yourself in some how turns to an arguement because you have to be the smartest guy on this forum. his question was on running crappy gas in a car not designed to run it. It's not smart. Plain and simple. Start a thread on "Dual Map" tuning if you'd like to discuss this. I'm done arguing. You obviously have some sort of "I've gotta be smarter" complex and it's pathetic. Keeping Googling.


Pot meet kettle...

I'm trying to stimulate information. Sometimes I have to pull it out of people and the same for me. This forum is about sharing, just because it might sound like I am arguing it's actually me trying to pull some information out of you. If only you answered my questions instead of dancing around them.

turbotiger
06-15-2006, 05:45 PM
I called it a tune, because TUNING is changing parameters while ON the dyno, flashing is plugging in, downloading a new map, off you go.

So NO, they're not ALL called flashes. There's TUNING, and there's FLASHES.

I would advise you to change your terminology as tuning is commonly referred to doing anything that you can to adjust your car. Flashes is just one of many ways of tuning.

evo_dadi
06-15-2006, 05:47 PM
lmao!!!my head hurts now.

Matz
06-15-2006, 05:50 PM
In the end, this whole "tuning" and "flashing" thing is just semantics in my opinion. But we all know what you're talking about now, so that's cool with me. I can see BaseModelEvo's point about flashing (like a P2 for instance) not technically being tuning for a specific car. I prefer earlyapex's "off the shelf" vs. "custom tuned" flash description, though.

On another note, I've googled about cars and tuning a lot, and I don't think earlyapex learned to tune Evos with a search engine.

BaseModelEvo
06-15-2006, 05:52 PM
"off the shelf" vs. "custom tuned"

agreed....good way to phrase it.

I'm sure he knows a bit about Evos, I'm sick of the arguing. he knew what I was talking about, we were just using different terminology. Just didn't need to argue. That's all.

KareBearPowa
06-15-2006, 05:53 PM
I'm sure he knows a bit about Evos, I'm sick of the arguing. he knew what I was talking about, we were just using different terminology. Just didn't need to argue. That's all.


Yes, I did, but some other people that come to this thread might not.

Again, you could have replied to me saying "off the shelf" vs. "custom tuned" without arguing like you just did to Matz post. It goes both ways homeslice. ;)

Matz
06-15-2006, 05:55 PM
I have to admit that I was confused, and originally disagreed with BaseModelEvo. But I am in agreement now. I was one of those that earlyapex referred to...

BaseModelEvo
06-15-2006, 06:01 PM
Solved. Good. Moving on... APEX ....should he be running 87 in his Evolution? Is it worth the risk?

xxx4reggie
06-15-2006, 06:36 PM
lol
87 octane rocks!! :lol:

BaseModelEvo
06-16-2006, 09:31 AM
lol
87 octane rocks!! :lol:


Thanks, Reg.

xxx4reggie
06-16-2006, 10:17 AM
lol
87 octane rocks!! :lol:


Thanks, Reg.


Your welcome.

p.s. I think to answer everyone's question, the best way to do it is for people to try it (the ones wililng to take the risk) let us know how it is, does you engine get worse or better, does the hp decrease or increase, does your mileage increase or decrease.
Things like that, we need real life answers.

ek9_evo9
06-16-2006, 10:48 AM
lol
87 octane rocks!! :lol:


Thanks, Reg.


Your welcome.

p.s. I think to answer everyone's question, the best way to do it is for people to try it (the ones wililng to take the risk) let us know how it is, does you engine get worse or better, does the hp decrease or increase, does your mileage increase or decrease.
Things like that, we need real life answers.


hmm i cant beleive this thread is still active.

here is the post to end it.

Do what you want...its your car not mine.

xxx4reggie
06-16-2006, 11:10 AM
lol
87 octane rocks!! :lol:


Thanks, Reg.


Your welcome.

p.s. I think to answer everyone's question, the best way to do it is for people to try it (the ones wililng to take the risk) let us know how it is, does you engine get worse or better, does the hp decrease or increase, does your mileage increase or decrease.
Things like that, we need real life answers.


hmm i cant beleive this thread is still active.

here is the post to end it.

Do what you want...its your car not mine.


WERD!!

BaseModelEvo
06-16-2006, 12:28 PM
p.s. I think to answer everyone's question, the best way to do it is for people to try it (the ones wililng to take the risk) let us know how it is, does you engine get worse or better, does the hp decrease or increase, does your mileage increase or decrease.
Things like that, we need real life answers.


Amen.

BMan
06-16-2006, 03:41 PM
lol
87 octane rocks!! :lol:




Thanks, Reg.


Your welcome.

p.s. I think to answer everyone's question, the best way to do it is for people to try it (the ones wililng to take the risk) let us know how it is, does you engine get worse or better, does the hp decrease or increase, does your mileage increase or decrease.
Things like that, we need real life answers.


That's what I was doing when I wrote this...


It's all about the tune. I had a '97 T-bird 4.6l (said to be a 87 octane engine without knock sensors) that I had reprogramed for power. When I went to visit family in SoCal I put 91 in it and it pinged so bad I had to add toluene to bring the octane up. Now the EVO has knock sensors and the ECU has several maps in it to protect the engine. No you won't be able to keep big power on low octane, or use a boost controler to up the boost, but it can be driven GENTLY.
If you add cams, intake, and high boost with no tune, all bets are off.


I have the instrumentation to prevent the boom, and felt that the information would be helpfull.
I don't think that 87 has enough anti-knock to even chance it with even 12 psi boost. With the 8:1 compression you could run 87 with no boost easily. I have found that the mpg has suffered some (a couple mpg), but the reason I set up with 89 was for safety...I go on long drives a lot and don't want to get stranded with no high octane. I do have a UTEC though, so next is the high octane map.

BaseModelEvo
06-16-2006, 05:40 PM
It still seems risking detonation (hell mine detonates a bit simply from HOT weather until it gets used to it) by running gas that's $.10 cheaper per gallon is simply preposterous! I mean we spent 25-35 THOUSAND on our cars, hundred in insurance, and you're willing to sacrafice (maybe!) a motor to save what... $200 a year in price difference?

10 galons of 87 = $30
10 gallons of 91 = $33

Monthly = fill once a week = $120/$132
Yearly @ same rate = $1440/$1584

So you save $144 a year to run SHIT for gas and probably lost half that in poor fuel economy from detonation (the car WILL add fuel to prevent it).

Serious... $144 ANNUAL savings is worth a motor? Even Doubled to $388 a year...still just not enough of a savings for me to even CONSIDER putting 87 in a car designed for 93. I fill with 97 EVERY chance I get! Just for fun.

If your economy is that poor, get a tune, you'll make almost 100hp at the flywheel and get almost 30mpg. I just did 73 miles to a quarter tank making 322 at my wheels... better economy than STOCK and more powerfull. And it's double what you save by putting GOOD fuel in your car.

APEX... agree here?

KareBearPowa
06-16-2006, 05:51 PM
I agree in the fact that trying to run 87 to save money isn't the best thing to do since, as you pointed out, it's not much of a savings but it's alot of risk.

I don't agree that 1/4 tank going 73 miles is somthing to brag about though, thats 20.8mpg ;)

I'd fill up on 100 octane every week if I had the means. ;)

BaseModelEvo
06-16-2006, 06:39 PM
I don't agree that 1/4 tank going 73 miles is somthing to brag about though, thats 20.8mpg ;)



MOSTLY city driving. Running Errands. I should have specified.




I'd fill up on 100 octane every week if I had the means. ;)



You and I both, homie.

MR_06
06-16-2006, 07:58 PM
I believe 87 octane will give you less mileage also. I don't think you will save much money by going 87. If I were you, I would try to save fuel to save money or get another vehicle designed for 87 with good mileage.


My friends and I had a new Lexus RX330 loaner car and took that thing to Vegas for the weekend. Required 91 octane but we pumped 87 the whole way. The car ran noticably worse, acceleration lacked power and lumpy and gas mileage was terrible.

It got us to and from Vegas though. We were cranking the A/C in 100 degree weather, lots of WOT runs on the highway on ramps, hauling 5 people and luggage with no problems.


its funny tho, sometimes loaners & rentals say just put in regular since they understand the cost of gas. so i assume they flush out the crap after so many users.

and when i bought my car, i was testing out the salesperson which was a chick.. cool person.. nice rack... but not to good in the EVO dept. anyways.. i asked "which gas should i put in this car? (i meant like chevron, 76 etc)." she responded "o.. u can put anything in, 87 octane is fine. with new cars today they are built better to handle the lower octane" so i just smiled staring @ her rack (while my lady was next to me =X ) n said ok.. while thinkin in my head.. HELL F*CKN NO!!

MR_06
06-16-2006, 08:00 PM
76 on corner of Watt and Marconi..$6.50 a gal......

xxx4reggie, there is a 76 Station that sells 100 Octane. It's on Watt...I don't know the cross street though. hahaha.



is that in sac by the fulton auto row or something? if so... i was there a few weeks ago cuz my lady bought an 06 SE accord.. n i didnt see no 100 octane..

EvoRicer
06-16-2006, 08:25 PM
is that in sac by the fulton auto row or something? if so... i was there a few weeks ago cuz my lady bought an 06 SE accord.. n i didnt see no 100 octane..


Number 1 Location on the Map.* They sell 100 Octane there...

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h77/TBEvo/getmap.gif

Gas Stations Near Your Location: 76 Gas Stations

* * 1. SUKH SINGH - 2849 WATT AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821
* * 2. MARCONI 76 - 2549 MARCONI AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95821
* * 3. FAST SERVE CALIF INC - 1300 FULTON AVE, SACRAMENTO, CA 95825
* * 4. FAIR OAKS 76 - 5103 FAIR OAKS BLVD, CARMICHAEL, CA 95608
* * 5. CoP Retail Site 2705519 - 3480 FAIR OAKS BLVD, SACRAMENTO, CA 95852
* * 6. CoP Retail Site 2705435 - 2200 FAIR OAKS BLVD, SACRAMENTO, CA 95825
* * 7. FAST SERV CALIF INC - 3312 BRADSHAW RD, SACRAMENTO, CA 95827
* * 8. KASRA KHADIVI DIMBALI 4565 - 5200 MANZANITA AVE, CARMICHAEL, CA 95608
* * 9. GAWFCO ENTERPRISES INC - 2893 65TH ST, SACRAMENTO, CA 95817

whtrice
06-17-2006, 06:15 AM
They only have one pump and it is located on the island facing Watt Ave. It is next to a Diesel pump and usually some big ass 4 X 4 is parked in front sucking up diesel.
So cool to see that "100" ROM sticker on the front!!!



76 on corner of Watt and Marconi..$6.50 a gal......

xxx4reggie, there is a 76 Station that sells 100 Octane. It's on Watt...I don't know the cross street though. hahaha.



is that in sac by the fulton auto row or something? if so... i was there a few weeks ago cuz my lady bought an 06 SE accord.. n i didnt see no 100 octane..

xxx4reggie
06-17-2006, 07:43 AM
drooooooooooooool
100 octane!!

EvoRicer
06-17-2006, 10:12 AM
Hahahha, everytime I go it's empty and I don't have to wait.

xxx4reggie
06-17-2006, 11:58 AM
^^^^^^^^^
Take me with you
lol
Mr. 12.99 with bad shifting :D

ek9_evo9
06-19-2006, 09:39 AM
I believe 87 octane will give you less mileage also. I don't think you will save much money by going 87. If I were you, I would try to save fuel to save money or get another vehicle designed for 87 with good mileage.


My friends and I had a new Lexus RX330 loaner car and took that thing to Vegas for the weekend. Required 91 octane but we pumped 87 the whole way. The car ran noticably worse, acceleration lacked power and lumpy and gas mileage was terrible.

It got us to and from Vegas though. We were cranking the A/C in 100 degree weather, lots of WOT runs on the highway on ramps, hauling 5 people and luggage with no problems.


its funny tho, sometimes loaners & rentals say just put in regular since they understand the cost of gas. so i assume they flush out the crap after so many users.

and when i bought my car, i was testing out the salesperson which was a chick.. cool person.. nice rack... but not to good in the EVO dept. anyways.. i asked "which gas should i put in this car? (i meant like chevron, 76 etc)." she responded "o.. u can put anything in, 87 octane is fine. with new cars today they are built better to handle the lower octane" so i just smiled staring @ her rack (while my lady was next to me =X ) n said ok.. while thinkin in my head.. HELL F*CKN NO!!


i heart boobs

BaseModelEvo
06-19-2006, 09:48 AM
i heart boobs




+1 .... +1 again... come on! I'm human...