Let's play the....

[KareBearPowa]

What's going on with this log game!


RPM TPS KnockSum TimingAdv Octane
3218.75 100 0 9 100
3281.25 100 0 9 100
3281.25 100 0 8 100
3375 100 0 8 100
3437.5 100 0 7 100
3531.25 100 0 6 100
3625 100 5 4 100
3687.5 100 5 4 100
3750 100 5 5 100
3812.5 100 5 5 100
3875 100 5 5 100
3906.25 100 5 5 100
4000 100 5 5 100
4031.25 100 5 6 100
4093.75 100 5 5 100
4125 100 4 5 100
4218.75 100 4 5 100
4281.25 100 4 7 100
4312.5 100 4 7 100
4406.25 100 4 7 100
4437.5 100 4 7 100
4500 100 4 7 100
4562.5 100 4 7 100
4593.75 100 4 7 100
4687.5 100 4 7 100
4718.75 100 4 7 100
4781.25 100 4 8 100
4875 100 3 9 100
4906.25 100 3 9 100
4968.75 100 3 9 100
5031.25 100 3 9 100
5093.75 100 3 9 100
5156.25 100 4 8 100
5218.75 100 4 8 100
5312.5 100 4 9 100
5343.75 100 4 9 100
5406.25 100 4 9 100
5468.75 100 4 8 100
5531.25 100 3 9 100
5593.75 100 3 10 100
5656.25 100 3 10 100
5687.5 100 3 10 100
5781.25 100 3 11 100
5812.5 100 3 11 100
5875 100 3 11 100
5937.5 100 3 11 100
6031.25 100 3 11 100
6031.25 100 3 11 100
6125 100 3 11 100
6156.25 100 2 11 100
6218.75 100 2 11 100
6281.25 100 2 12 100
6343.75 100 2 12 100
6375 100 2 12 100
6406.25 100 2 12 100
6468.75 100 2 13 100
6500 100 2 13 100
6562.5 100 2 13 100
6593.75 100 2 13 100
6656.25 100 2 14 100
6687.5 100 2 14 100
6750 100 1 15 100
6781.25 100 1 15 100
6843.75 100 1 15 100
6875 100 1 16 100
6937.5 100 1 16 100
6968.75 100 1 16 100
7031.25 100 1 16 100
7062.5 100 1 16 100
7125 100 1 17 100
7156.25 100 1 17 100
7218.75 100 1 17 100
7250 100 0 18 100
7281.25 100 0 18 100
7312.5 100 0 18 100
7375 100 0 18 100
7406.25 100 0 18 100
7437.5 100 0 18 100
7468.75 100 0 18 100
7531.25 100 0 18 100

First one to get the right answer gets a lollipop. ;)

[KareBearPowa]

and another log with a different problem:


RPM O2Sensor TPS KnockSum TimingAdv
2437.5 0.8775 100 0 16
2437.5 0.8775 100 0 16
2500 0.8775 100 0 15
2500 0.8775 100 0 14
2531.25 0.8775 100 0 13
2562.5 0.8775 100 0 12
2593.75 0.8775 100 0 13
2625 0.897 100 0 11
2656.25 0.897 100 0 10
2687.5 0.897 100 0 10
2718.75 0.897 100 0 9
2750 0.897 100 0 9
2812.5 0.897 100 0 8
2843.75 0.897 100 0 7
2875 0.897 100 0 7
2906.25 0.897 100 0 7
2968.75 0.897 100 0 7
3000 0.897 100 0 7
3031.25 0.897 100 0 6
3093.75 0.897 100 0 6
3125 0.9165 100 0 6
3187.5 0.897 100 0 6
3250 0.9165 100 0 6
3312.5 0.9165 100 0 5
3343.75 0.9165 100 0 5
3437.5 0.9165 100 0 6
3468.75 0.9165 100 2 5
3531.25 0.9165 100 2 5
3593.75 0.9165 100 1 5
3625 0.9165 100 1 5
3718.75 0.9165 100 1 5
3781.25 0.9165 100 1 7
3843.75 0.9165 100 3 6
3906.25 0.9165 100 3 6
3937.5 0.9165 100 3 6
4031.25 0.9165 100 3 6
4093.75 0.9165 100 3 6
4125 0.936 100 3 6
4218.75 0.936 100 3 6
4250 0.936 100 3 7
4375 0.936 100 2 7
4375 0.936 100 2 8
4468.75 0.936 100 2 8
4500 0.936 100 2 8
4625 0.936 100 2 8
4625 0.936 100 2 7
4687.5 0.936 100 2 7
4781.25 0.936 100 2 8
4812.5 0.936 100 2 8
4875 0.936 100 2 8
4906.25 0.936 100 2 8
4968.75 0.936 100 1 8
5031.25 0.9165 100 1 8
5093.75 0.9165 100 1 9
5156.25 0.936 100 1 9
5187.5 0.9165 100 1 9
5281.25 0.936 100 2 10
5312.5 0.936 100 2 9
5406.25 0.936 100 2 10
5437.5 0.936 100 2 10
5531.25 0.936 100 2 10
5562.5 0.936 100 1 10
5625 0.936 100 1 10
5656.25 0.936 100 1 10
5750 0.936 100 1 11
5781.25 0.936 100 1 11
5875 0.936 100 1 11
5906.25 0.936 100 1 11
5968.75 0.936 100 1 11
6031.25 0.936 100 1 11
6062.5 0.936 100 1 11
6125 0.936 100 1 11
6156.25 0.936 100 0 12
6250 0.936 100 0 13
6312.5 0.936 100 0 14
6312.5 0.936 100 0 14
6406.25 0.936 100 0 14
6437.5 0.936 100 0 14
6531.25 0.936 100 0 14
6562.5 0.936 100 0 14
6593.75 0.936 100 0 14
6656.25 0.936 100 0 15
6687.5 0.936 100 0 16
6750 0.936 100 0 16
6781.25 0.936 100 0 16
6843.75 0.936 100 0 16
6843.75 0.936 100 0 16
6906.25 0.936 100 0 17
6937.5 0.936 100 0 17
6968.75 0.936 100 0 17
7031.25 0.936 100 0 17
7062.5 0.936 100 0 18
7125 0.936 100 0 18
7156.25 0.936 100 0 18
7187.5 0.936 100 1 17
7218.75 0.936 100 0 18
7281.25 0.936 100 0 18
7312.5 0.936 100 0 18
7343.75 0.936 100 0 18
7406.25 0.936 100 0 18
7437.5 0.936 100 0 18
7500 0.936 100 0 18
7531.25 0.936 40 0 30

[chrisw]

are these logs both from the same car in the same dyno session?

[KareBearPowa]

are these logs both from the same car in the same dyno session?


Same car, same session, but on the road.

[chrisw]

I'll go for too much timing at peak torque... 'cuz I have been following that other thread on evom.. :)

[EV0LL]

1st one is knocking a lot early in the rpm range, perhaps running too much boost?

[KareBearPowa]

You're both right but Jason is 100% right.

Too much boost for the timing. Jason kind of cheated since he was sitting in the car with me. :P

how about the 2nd log?

[EV0LL]

Ya but I never really saw the logs, just remembered you mentioning it.* :)

2nd log, too rich, not enuff boost? Much harder too tell. That a 9 or 8?

[ST]

1st one - whats wrong? ks is not propogating to octane rating being lowered. Timing is NOT getting pulled correspondingly...did someone fugdge with knock filter maps and / or flatten the maps?

2nd one - looks like ur typical too much timing/high afr at peak boost...need to see correlating afrs and/or ipws / boost levels...

[EV0LL]

1st one - whats wrong? ks is not propogating to octane rating being lowered. Timing is NOT getting pulled correspondingly...did someone fugdge with knock filter maps and / or flatten the maps?


you're right dude, its a conspiracy! Early Apex is trying to trick you!! :shock:

or maybe you didn't see the other replies....?

[ST]

you're right dude, its a conspiracy! Early Apex is trying to trick you!! :shock:

or maybe you didn't see the other replies....?


so you or someone else replied it being stable at 100 eh, even with the knocks? Do you even know what the octane column is for? :lol:

[KareBearPowa]

1st one - whats wrong? ks is not propogating to octane rating being lowered. Timing is NOT getting pulled correspondingly...did someone fugdge with knock filter maps and / or flatten the maps?

Timing is being pulled. Octane rating gets lowered with increased and/or prolonged knock. Maps are not flat, knock filters are stock. This is a 8 so it's not as aggressive with timing being pulled as 9's, at least from what I have seen.



2nd one - looks like ur typical too much timing/high afr at peak boost...need to see correlating afrs and/or ipws / boost levels...


You're right, bit too lean for the boost and timing.

both are my personal evo 8.

[EV0LL]

you're right dude, its a conspiracy! Early Apex is trying to trick you!! :shock:

or maybe you didn't see the other replies....?


so you or someone else replied it being stable at 100 eh, even with the knocks?


I did? Don't belive so, did you actually bother to read the thread or are you just pulling this all out of thin air?

[ST]

Timing is being pulled. Octane rating gets lowered with increased and/or prolonged knock. Maps are not flat, knock filters are stock. This is a 8 so it's not as aggressive with timing being pulled as 9's, at least from what I have seen.




this is quite intersting EA - your ECU doesn't adhere to the usual ks octane based calcs to base off of low/hi map interpolation? *0-3 increment, 4-5 nada, 5+ decrement

Seems the 8's are definitely more resilient to ks, contrary to what folks say...you're right, on ix's, even with just 1-2 ks, ecu can and will pull timing, as i believe it is based more on coolant, baro temps, as well as engine load.

[ST]

I did? Don't belive so, did you actually bother to read the thread or are you just pulling this all out of thin air?


"or maybe you didn't see the other replies....?"O.o

i think ur prozac pills are running low..

[KareBearPowa]

this is quite intersting EA - your ECU doesn't adhere to the usual ks octane based calcs to base off of low/hi map interpolation? 0-3 increment, 4-5 nada, 5+ decrement

Well the highest knock in those logs are 5 and only for a small amount of time then dropping.. So I would say it was probably right on the edge of octane reduction and I would say it is following what you typed above.



Seems the 8's are definitely more resilient to ks, contrary to what folks say...you're right, on ix's, even with just 1-2 ks, ecu can and will pull timing, as i believe it is based more on coolant, baro temps, as well as engine load.


Yea I agree but it also depends on more then just knock counts like you said. Sometimes I get 1 knock count and pulled timing, sometimes 3 and no pulled timing. There is actually a case of 1 knock count in those logs above with pulled timing. (log #2 @ 7187.5)

[KareBearPowa]

Here's another one. Tuned on the edge:


RPM TPS KnockSum TimingAdv Octane
3125 100 0 8 100
3156.25 100 0 7 100
3218.75 100 0 7 100
3250 100 0 7 100
3312.5 100 1 7 100
3343.75 100 1 5 100
3406.25 100 1 5 100
3468.75 100 1 5 100
3468.75 100 3 5 100
3562.5 100 3 5 100
3625 100 3 5 100
3656.25 100 3 5 100
3781.25 100 3 6 100
3781.25 100 3 6 100
3875 100 2 7 100
3937.5 100 2 6 100
3968.75 100 2 7 100
4093.75 100 2 7 100
4093.75 100 2 6 100
4187.5 100 2 6 100
4250 100 2 6 100
4281.25 100 2 8 100
4375 100 2 8 100
4406.25 100 2 8 100
4500 100 2 8 100
4531.25 100 1 8 100
4593.75 100 1 8 100
4687.5 100 1 8 100
4750 100 1 9 100
4812.5 100 1 9 100
4875 100 1 9 100
4937.5 100 1 8 100
5031.25 100 1 9 100
5093.75 100 3 9 100
5125 100 3 9 100
5218.75 100 2 9 100
5281.25 100 2 9 100
5312.5 100 2 9 100
5375 100 2 9 100
5468.75 100 2 9 100
5500 100 2 9 100
5562.5 100 2 9 100
5625 100 2 9 100
5687.5 100 2 9 100
5750 100 2 9 100
5812.5 100 2 11 100
5875 100 1 11 100
5906.25 100 1 11 100
5968.75 100 1 11 100
6031.25 100 1 11 100
6093.75 100 1 11 100
6156.25 100 1 11 100
6218.75 100 1 12 100
6281.25 100 1 12 100
6343.75 100 1 12 100
6406.25 100 0 13 100
6468.75 100 0 14 100
6531.25 100 0 14 100
6562.5 100 0 14 100
6625 100 0 15 100
6687.5 100 0 15 100
6687.5 100 0 15 100
6750 100 2 14 100
6812.5 100 2 14 100
6843.75 100 2 15 100
6906.25 100 2 16 100
6937.5 100 1 16 100
6968.75 100 1 16 100
7031.25 100 1 16 100
7062.5 100 1 16 100
7125 100 1 16 100
7156.25 100 1 16 100
7187.5 100 1 17 100
7218.75 100 1 17 100
7250 100 1 17 100
7312.5 100 1 17 100
7343.75 100 1 17 100
7406.25 100 1 17 100

[KareBearPowa]

And here's one with Octane reduction for ST, this is knock from bouncing off the rev limiter:


RPM TPS KnockSum TimingAdv Octane
7031.25 100 0 17 100
7093.75 100 0 18 100
7125 100 0 18 100
7187.5 100 0 18 100
7218.75 100 0 18 100
7281.25 100 0 18 100
7312.5 100 0 18 100
7406.25 100 0 18 100
7406.25 100 0 18 100
7468.75 100 0 18 100
7531.25 100 0 18 100
7531.25 100 0 18 100
7593.75 100 0 18 100
7437.5 100 0 18 100
7343.75 100 9 17 100
7781.25 100 9 16 99.60784314
7687.5 43.92156863 9 20 99.60784314
7500 15.29411765 3 37 99.60784314
7468.75 15.29411765 0 38 99.60784314
7343.75 14.90196078 0 38 99.60784314
7250 14.90196078 0 38 99.60784314
7062.5 14.50980392 0 38 99.60784314

[ST]

I'm not as code literate, but here's an oldy but goody:





RPM* * *Knock* * * *Timing* *Octane* * * * * Airflow

4031.25 0 7* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
4125 1 7* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
4312.5 0 7* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
4531.25 0 -3* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
4687.5 0 8* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
4750 0 8* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
4937.5 0 8* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
4906.25 0 -2* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
5093.75 0 9* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95
5187.5 0 9* * * * * 100* * * * * *1603.95

[KareBearPowa]

Lol I have no idea whats going on there. Octane set really low and its grabbing randomly from the low octane map?

btw, just use the code tag button and it should format it nicer (the button that has the # on it).

[ST]

added a couple more clues...this stumped me for a while as well....thought my ecu was on the fritz!

[dohcvtec]

typo in the map? lol. misfire?

[Matz]

OT post deleted, sorry guys.

[KareBearPowa]

Your maf is fugged up. you are showing almost 400hz too much at 4000 rpm

[ST]

Your maf is fugged up. you are showing almost 400hz too much at 4000 rpm


Got one of the contributing issues! Its more around 1400s typically...:)

[KareBearPowa]

Your maf is fugged up. you are showing almost 400hz too much at 4000 rpm


Got one of the contributing issues! Its more around 1400s typically...:)



1400 at 4000rpm? Do you have IC pipes?

Did you also have a open air filter for that log?

[ST]

1400 at 4000rpm? Do you have IC pipes?

Did you also have a open air filter for that log?


yes ic pipes and conical air filter

[KareBearPowa]

yes ic pipes and conical air filter


Ok, air filter screwed with MAF readings, possible damaged honeycomb?

[ST]

yes ic pipes and conical air filter


Ok, air filter screwed with MAF readings, possible damaged honeycomb?


getting warmer! :p

[KareBearPowa]

getting warmer! :p


Bleh, I lost interest. Post a full log.:P

[zyounker]

Having this exact same issue with a friends car.. He is getting knock at 4K rpms and AirFlow is showing 1600 as well.. I was gonna change out the MAF this weekend.. Please let me know if there is something else i should check. (Or PM)


Thanks,
-Zach